Baha’is on Both Sides of Docket: US & Egypt

judge-gavelThe Baha’i community is receiving some good news from Egypt. In case you’re not familiar with the situation there, it involves the right of Egyptian Baha’is to have government issued ID cards. You can read more about it on Wikipedia.

According to the Muslim Network for Baha’i Rights, there ruling will probably come in a few days and it will most probably be favorable for the Baha’is. I hope it will put an end to this and the Egyptian Baha’is can live in peace.

Meanwhile, over in the US the Baha’is are also involved in a court case but they are acting as the plaintiffs rather than defendants. The case involves the Orthodox Baha’is and their use of Baha’i names, symbols and trademarks. You can read about it to get some background information. The US NSA was trying to enforce a crazy 1966 ruling against Mason Remey and his organization for infringing on Baha’i copyright.

The NSA of the Baha’is of the United States lost the case last year when the presiding judge ruled that there was no “substantial continuity between the NSA-UHG and the PNBC”. What she meant was that the 1966 ruling was enforceable on Remey’s organization but the current Orthodox Baha’i group has little if any resemblance to it.

Unfortunately the NSA of the Baha’is of the US decided to appeal this ruling. The case will come before the Seventh Circuit Court of Appeals and be argued before a panel of judges on February 20th, 2009.

It is sad to see the NSA spend so much time and the precious resources of the Faith to engage in a legal wrangle of this sort. It is especially lamentable when you consider that it is all based on a flimsy ruling which will not stand up to the most superficial scrutiny.

Would any legal minds reading this care to offer their opinion as to why the Orthodox Baha’is haven’t simply attacked the trademark basis of the 1966 ruling? After all, the word “Baha’i” can not be owned by any one organization, just as the term Christian doesn’t belong to only the Catholic Church.

  • P

    I’m not a legal mind by any means, but it really depends on Bahai being applied as a generic term to a religion or to a specific organized entity. In some countries the word “Mormon” and “Latter Day Saints” have been trademarked. Although the LDS chruch has not been able to do the same in the US, but they are still trying to get the trademark on these words.

  • P

    I’m not a legal mind by any means, but it really depends on Bahai being applied as a generic term to a religion or to a specific organized entity. In some countries the word “Mormon” and “Latter Day Saints” have been trademarked. Although the LDS chruch has not been able to do the same in the US, but they are still trying to get the trademark on these words.

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    Given that Egypt is the recipent of annual subsidies from the US and depends on its tourism industry in large measure; given the fact that Egypt is a dictatorship amenable to manipulation by whoever signs a check on behalf of its entrenched elite; and especially given that both a government department as well as the High Court of the land had already specifically ruled against this on solid legal grounds, the fact that last year we had a 360 degree about face only leads to the conclusion that the Bahais actively lobbied the United States government to lean on the Egyptian government of Hosni Mubarak for such reversal.

    As for the so-called ‘Muslim Network of Bahai Rights’, who exactly are they? Who are the board members of this organization specifically? I say this because this organization appears to be a dudd-front/foundation with no immediately identifiable coordination body.

    People should also consider the following article vis-a-vis the Egyptian case,
    http://www.zmag.org/znet/viewArticle/14804

    And consider the following press release, which this site is conspicuously quiet regarding,
    http://in.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idINIndia-37272920090103

    See also,
    http://gaybahai.yuku.com/forum/viewtopic/id/423

    W

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    Given that Egypt is the recipent of annual subsidies from the US and depends on its tourism industry in large measure; given the fact that Egypt is a dictatorship amenable to manipulation by whoever signs a check on behalf of its entrenched elite; and especially given that both a government department as well as the High Court of the land had already specifically ruled against this on solid legal grounds, the fact that last year we had a 360 degree about face only leads to the conclusion that the Bahais actively lobbied the United States government to lean on the Egyptian government of Hosni Mubarak for such reversal.

    As for the so-called ‘Muslim Network of Bahai Rights’, who exactly are they? Who are the board members of this organization specifically? I say this because this organization appears to be a dudd-front/foundation with no immediately identifiable coordination body.

    People should also consider the following article vis-a-vis the Egyptian case,
    http://www.zmag.org/znet/viewArticle/14804

    And consider the following press release, which this site is conspicuously quiet regarding,
    http://in.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idINIndia-37272920090103

    See also,
    http://gaybahai.yuku.com/forum/viewtopic/id/423

    W

  • annoymouz

    [quote comment=""]

    As for the so-called ‘Muslim Network of Bahai Rights’, who exactly are they? Who are the board members of this organization specifically? I say this because this organization appears to be a dudd-front/foundation with no immediately identifiable coordination body.

    W[/quote]

    MNBR is part of Mideastyouth.com which hosts a number of other human rights projects including human trafficking, migrant rights, Kurds, Chinese bloggers etc…Esra’a Al-Shafei is the 20 something director from Bahrain.

  • annoymouz

    [quote comment=""]

    As for the so-called ‘Muslim Network of Bahai Rights’, who exactly are they? Who are the board members of this organization specifically? I say this because this organization appears to be a dudd-front/foundation with no immediately identifiable coordination body.

    W[/quote]

    MNBR is part of Mideastyouth.com which hosts a number of other human rights projects including human trafficking, migrant rights, Kurds, Chinese bloggers etc…Esra’a Al-Shafei is the 20 something director from Bahrain.

  • Omeed

    I’m not so sure what makes the IP litigation here “crazy”, or “based on a flimsy ruling which will not stand up to the most superficial scrutiny.”–surely that’s a judgment for the courts to make right? To you they may be crazy or feeble, but the law is different–and I think that this is the difference between opinion and fact.

    The legal system does allow for trademarks to be established and defended, and it is the purview of the courts as to what is legal or not. This is probably why they have cited the Remey case, not so much because of its direct relevance, but to refer to precedent. But, ignoring that, I think it may be somewhat of a straw man to consider that the sole purpose of this case is to attack the 40 people involved in X or Y covenant breaking group–but rather, this is probably more about bolstering the IP rights that we currently have over our name and symbols, which then becomes applicable to any future case. In other words, it’s an indefinite defense against countless groups–which we can and should have the right to have.

    I guess what I’m saying is: I don’t have a problem with IP protection in general, and because I don’t have any problem with it in general, I don’t have any problem with it here. Basically, I feel that the courts have the jurisdiction on what is lawful, and that the NSA is doing the right thing in testing it–in fact, I think they’d be remiss if they didn’t.

  • Omeed

    I’m not so sure what makes the IP litigation here “crazy”, or “based on a flimsy ruling which will not stand up to the most superficial scrutiny.”–surely that’s a judgment for the courts to make right? To you they may be crazy or feeble, but the law is different–and I think that this is the difference between opinion and fact.

    The legal system does allow for trademarks to be established and defended, and it is the purview of the courts as to what is legal or not. This is probably why they have cited the Remey case, not so much because of its direct relevance, but to refer to precedent. But, ignoring that, I think it may be somewhat of a straw man to consider that the sole purpose of this case is to attack the 40 people involved in X or Y covenant breaking group–but rather, this is probably more about bolstering the IP rights that we currently have over our name and symbols, which then becomes applicable to any future case. In other words, it’s an indefinite defense against countless groups–which we can and should have the right to have.

    I guess what I’m saying is: I don’t have a problem with IP protection in general, and because I don’t have any problem with it in general, I don’t have any problem with it here. Basically, I feel that the courts have the jurisdiction on what is lawful, and that the NSA is doing the right thing in testing it–in fact, I think they’d be remiss if they didn’t.

  • http://www.bahairants.com Baquia

    Omeed, if this is a question of IP rights, then it is absolutely ridiculous. There is no way that you can “copyright” or trademark a religious name such as Christian, Jew, Muslim, etc. The defendants haven’t taken this approach but rather to show that their organization is separate from the one which the 1966 ruling applies to.

  • http://www.bahairants.com Baquia

    Omeed, if this is a question of IP rights, then it is absolutely ridiculous. There is no way that you can “copyright” or trademark a religious name such as Christian, Jew, Muslim, etc. The defendants haven’t taken this approach but rather to show that their organization is separate from the one which the 1966 ruling applies to.

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]MNBR is part of Mideastyouth.com which hosts a number of other human rights projects including human trafficking, migrant rights, Kurds, Chinese bloggers etc…Esra’a Al-Shafei is the 20 something director from Bahrain..[/quote]

    You just made my point for me. Esra Al-Shafei is only 1 person – uno, une, yek, waahed! Maybe in the Twilight Zone world of Bahai involvement in hokey Liberal Foundations attempting to “manufacture consent” and wave-hands making up down and down up, a single person constitutes a whole *NETWORK*, but not in the real world! MidEast Youth is also not a bona fide organization, let alone part of a larger network (all headed by the same person).

    I asked a valid question: who are the coordination committee, sitting members of the MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHAI RIGHTS? Real, bona fide organizations have coordination/steering comittees, members and an assemblage of either paid or volunteer bureaucrats. A organization of one consisting of a whole network of purported sites all steered by the same person does not a *real* organization or network make. And this, my dear, is the reason why Mr Esra’a Al-Shafei and his whole slew of fake, online (pseudo-)organizations have now found themselves entries on SourceWatch!

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]MNBR is part of Mideastyouth.com which hosts a number of other human rights projects including human trafficking, migrant rights, Kurds, Chinese bloggers etc…Esra’a Al-Shafei is the 20 something director from Bahrain..[/quote]

    You just made my point for me. Esra Al-Shafei is only 1 person – uno, une, yek, waahed! Maybe in the Twilight Zone world of Bahai involvement in hokey Liberal Foundations attempting to “manufacture consent” and wave-hands making up down and down up, a single person constitutes a whole *NETWORK*, but not in the real world! MidEast Youth is also not a bona fide organization, let alone part of a larger network (all headed by the same person).

    I asked a valid question: who are the coordination committee, sitting members of the MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHAI RIGHTS? Real, bona fide organizations have coordination/steering comittees, members and an assemblage of either paid or volunteer bureaucrats. A organization of one consisting of a whole network of purported sites all steered by the same person does not a *real* organization or network make. And this, my dear, is the reason why Mr Esra’a Al-Shafei and his whole slew of fake, online (pseudo-)organizations have now found themselves entries on SourceWatch!

    Wahid

  • annonymouz

    [quote comment=""]
    I asked a valid question: who are the coordination committee, sitting members of the MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHAI RIGHTS? Real, bona fide organizations have coordination/steering comittees, members and an assemblage of either paid or volunteer bureaucrats. A organization of one consisting of a whole network of purported sites all steered by the same person does not a *real* organization or network make. And this, my dear, is the reason why Mr Esra’a Al-Shafei and his whole slew of fake, online (pseudo-)organizations have now found themselves entries on SourceWatch!

    Wahid[/quote]

    Well Nima maybe I’ll point you in the right direction. Here is a link of the staff.

    They are an NGO in based in the US and from what I have read Pakistan.

  • annonymouz

    [quote comment=""]
    I asked a valid question: who are the coordination committee, sitting members of the MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHAI RIGHTS? Real, bona fide organizations have coordination/steering comittees, members and an assemblage of either paid or volunteer bureaucrats. A organization of one consisting of a whole network of purported sites all steered by the same person does not a *real* organization or network make. And this, my dear, is the reason why Mr Esra’a Al-Shafei and his whole slew of fake, online (pseudo-)organizations have now found themselves entries on SourceWatch!

    Wahid[/quote]

    Well Nima maybe I’ll point you in the right direction. Here is a link of the staff.

    They are an NGO in based in the US and from what I have read Pakistan.

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""][quote comment=""]
    I asked a valid question: who are the coordination committee, sitting members of the MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHAI RIGHTS? Real, bona fide organizations have coordination/steering comittees, members and an assemblage of either paid or volunteer bureaucrats. A organization of one consisting of a whole network of purported sites all steered by the same person does not a *real* organization or network make. And this, my dear, is the reason why Mr Esra’a Al-Shafei and his whole slew of fake, online (pseudo-)organizations have now found themselves entries on SourceWatch!

    Wahid[/quote]

    Well Nima maybe I’ll point you in the right direction. Here is a link of the staff. http://mideastyouth.com/about-us/

    You are so off your rocker man. Get a life. They are an NGO in based in the US and from what I have read Pakistan.

    http://mideastyouthfoundation.org/legal//quote

    The first link you’ve provided does not provide any information whatsoever as to the organizational nature of MidEastYouth or who (besides the one-man-show “Esra Al-Shafei” who is isn’t even mentioned) serves on any organizational committee or board, not to mention the structural nature of any memberships. It is a mission statement. Period!

    The second link is likewise the same only mentioning that it is in pursuit of a 501(c) non-profit status. Nada, nothing, niente! No mention of organizational structure, boards, steering committees, names of officers, more importantly donors (which they would have had to disclose publically by law for the sort non-for-profit status they are seeking to be in effect), etc. Nothing of the sort is on any of those sites. You have not only NOT proven anything here – and given the blatant pro-Bahai slant of those pages especially last year during the Montazeri letter scam – you have further reinforced my allegation that this organization is a dudd, a front, a scam, a hoax. Once you have names and tangible information as to what the nuts and bolts of this so-called Network and its assorted subsidiaries are, get back. Until then, just because you Bahaim live day in, day out in a world of false constructs, deliberate deceptions, sleights of hand, smoke and mirror smokescreens, plausible denials, wooly silences, outright lying and such like do not assume others do or that others do not see through you people for what you are and what you do.

    And my name is WAHID. Kindly remember it.

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""][quote comment=""]
    I asked a valid question: who are the coordination committee, sitting members of the MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHAI RIGHTS? Real, bona fide organizations have coordination/steering comittees, members and an assemblage of either paid or volunteer bureaucrats. A organization of one consisting of a whole network of purported sites all steered by the same person does not a *real* organization or network make. And this, my dear, is the reason why Mr Esra’a Al-Shafei and his whole slew of fake, online (pseudo-)organizations have now found themselves entries on SourceWatch!

    Wahid[/quote]

    Well Nima maybe I’ll point you in the right direction. Here is a link of the staff. http://mideastyouth.com/about-us/

    You are so off your rocker man. Get a life. They are an NGO in based in the US and from what I have read Pakistan.

    http://mideastyouthfoundation.org/legal//quote

    The first link you’ve provided does not provide any information whatsoever as to the organizational nature of MidEastYouth or who (besides the one-man-show “Esra Al-Shafei” who is isn’t even mentioned) serves on any organizational committee or board, not to mention the structural nature of any memberships. It is a mission statement. Period!

    The second link is likewise the same only mentioning that it is in pursuit of a 501(c) non-profit status. Nada, nothing, niente! No mention of organizational structure, boards, steering committees, names of officers, more importantly donors (which they would have had to disclose publically by law for the sort non-for-profit status they are seeking to be in effect), etc. Nothing of the sort is on any of those sites. You have not only NOT proven anything here – and given the blatant pro-Bahai slant of those pages especially last year during the Montazeri letter scam – you have further reinforced my allegation that this organization is a dudd, a front, a scam, a hoax. Once you have names and tangible information as to what the nuts and bolts of this so-called Network and its assorted subsidiaries are, get back. Until then, just because you Bahaim live day in, day out in a world of false constructs, deliberate deceptions, sleights of hand, smoke and mirror smokescreens, plausible denials, wooly silences, outright lying and such like do not assume others do or that others do not see through you people for what you are and what you do.

    And my name is WAHID. Kindly remember it.

    Wahid

  • maybeIam

    [quote comment=""]

    Well Nima maybe I’ll point you in the right direction. Here is a link of the staff. http://mideastyouth.com/about-us/

    You are so off your rocker man. Get a life. They are an NGO in based in the US and from what I have read Pakistan.

    http://mideastyouthfoundation.org/legal//quote

    I would also like to be shown an official link, not to Mid-East Youth, but to something that demonstrates that the Muslim Network for Bahai Rights is in fact a bona-fide’network’, and not merely the work of an individual. This is a reasonable request of an NGO group.

  • maybeIam

    [quote comment=""]

    Well Nima maybe I’ll point you in the right direction. Here is a link of the staff. http://mideastyouth.com/about-us/

    You are so off your rocker man. Get a life. They are an NGO in based in the US and from what I have read Pakistan.

    http://mideastyouthfoundation.org/legal//quote

    I would also like to be shown an official link, not to Mid-East Youth, but to something that demonstrates that the Muslim Network for Bahai Rights is in fact a bona-fide’network’, and not merely the work of an individual. This is a reasonable request of an NGO group.

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    “They are an NGO in based in the US and from what I have read Pakistan.”

    Additionally, let’s see who is way off and truly off their rocker:

    http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Esra%27a_Al_Shafei
    “Esra’a al-Shafei, a blogger from Bahrain, is the co-founder of http://www.mideastyouth.com and the Middle East Interfaith Blogger Network. She also runs FreeKareem.org aimed to free a jailed friend and fellow blogger.”

    There’s a marked difference between Bahran and Pakistan, sherlock! That’s for your first garbled fact. Second, according to Esra’a al-Shafei herself, as stated on SourceWatch here,
    http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Mideast_Youth
    “This is a two-person show, I’m in charge of content management and the ideas, and my friend Lalith, who runs lazybeelab, is in charge of design and technical support. He co-owns MidEast Youth and our many networks. I wouldn’t have come this far without his much needed help, this is why I put him in charge of executive decisions regarding the site as well…”
    as sourced from here,
    http://globalvoicesonline.org/2007/04/12/arabeyes-esraa-al-shafei-your-one-stop-cyber-activist/

    MidEast Youth was a two-man show as of April 2007. As of January 19 2009 two-persons have now quadrupled into the following staff of full-time individuals (the information you were reluctant to provide BTW):

    Esra’a Al Shafei (Bahrain) – Director
    Kawthar Muhaib (UAE) – Project assistant
    Tamara Al-Om (Syria) – Moderator & General Assistant
    Omid T. (Iran/USA) – Moderator & Legal Adviser
    Tori Egherman (Iran/USA) – Budget manager/General Lifesaver
    Mohammad Memarian (Iran) – Translation Services – Farsi
    Nadia Ayadi (Tunisia) – French translations
    Elisheva Cohen (Israel) – Director of Public Relations
    Leah Lublin (Israel) – Interfaith Manager
    Siham Ihouline (Morocco) – Occasional project Translator
    http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Mideast_Youth
    -

    Stay tuned, folks, as we begin to reveal here the various funding, political and Washington-based PAC (political action committee) big-lobby connections to several of the people mentioned sitting above on that board. Especially interesing here is how you have two Israelis and one American Jew whose name is eerily similar to a certain AIPAC (American-Israeli Public Affairs Committee) coordinating director serving on the board of a network whose immediate subsidiary is the organization calling its MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHA’I RIGHTS.

    Annonymouz, can you say ‘WAG THE DOG’ ?

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    “They are an NGO in based in the US and from what I have read Pakistan.”

    Additionally, let’s see who is way off and truly off their rocker:

    http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Esra%27a_Al_Shafei
    “Esra’a al-Shafei, a blogger from Bahrain, is the co-founder of http://www.mideastyouth.com and the Middle East Interfaith Blogger Network. She also runs FreeKareem.org aimed to free a jailed friend and fellow blogger.”

    There’s a marked difference between Bahran and Pakistan, sherlock! That’s for your first garbled fact. Second, according to Esra’a al-Shafei herself, as stated on SourceWatch here,
    http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Mideast_Youth
    “This is a two-person show, I’m in charge of content management and the ideas, and my friend Lalith, who runs lazybeelab, is in charge of design and technical support. He co-owns MidEast Youth and our many networks. I wouldn’t have come this far without his much needed help, this is why I put him in charge of executive decisions regarding the site as well…”
    as sourced from here,
    http://globalvoicesonline.org/2007/04/12/arabeyes-esraa-al-shafei-your-one-stop-cyber-activist/

    MidEast Youth was a two-man show as of April 2007. As of January 19 2009 two-persons have now quadrupled into the following staff of full-time individuals (the information you were reluctant to provide BTW):

    Esra’a Al Shafei (Bahrain) – Director
    Kawthar Muhaib (UAE) – Project assistant
    Tamara Al-Om (Syria) – Moderator & General Assistant
    Omid T. (Iran/USA) – Moderator & Legal Adviser
    Tori Egherman (Iran/USA) – Budget manager/General Lifesaver
    Mohammad Memarian (Iran) – Translation Services – Farsi
    Nadia Ayadi (Tunisia) – French translations
    Elisheva Cohen (Israel) – Director of Public Relations
    Leah Lublin (Israel) – Interfaith Manager
    Siham Ihouline (Morocco) – Occasional project Translator
    http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Mideast_Youth
    -

    Stay tuned, folks, as we begin to reveal here the various funding, political and Washington-based PAC (political action committee) big-lobby connections to several of the people mentioned sitting above on that board. Especially interesing here is how you have two Israelis and one American Jew whose name is eerily similar to a certain AIPAC (American-Israeli Public Affairs Committee) coordinating director serving on the board of a network whose immediate subsidiary is the organization calling its MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHA’I RIGHTS.

    Annonymouz, can you say ‘WAG THE DOG’ ?

    Wahid

  • http://www.bahairants.com Baquia

    Feel free to discuss and disagree. At the same time, keep the tone civil and on topic. There is zero tolerance for personal insults. Thank you.

  • http://www.bahairants.com Baquia

    Feel free to discuss and disagree. At the same time, keep the tone civil and on topic. There is zero tolerance for personal insults. Thank you.

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]Feel free to discuss and disagree. At the same time, keep the tone civil and on topic. There is zero tolerance for personal insults. Thank you.[/quote]

    Noted. But I also note, Baquia, that you always weigh in on this issue whenever an insult is reciprocated by non-Bahais towards insults initiated by Bahais. Seldom do you weigh against fellow Bahais for initiating insults in the first place.

    FYI

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]Feel free to discuss and disagree. At the same time, keep the tone civil and on topic. There is zero tolerance for personal insults. Thank you.[/quote]

    Noted. But I also note, Baquia, that you always weigh in on this issue whenever an insult is reciprocated by non-Bahais towards insults initiated by Bahais. Seldom do you weigh against fellow Bahais for initiating insults in the first place.

    FYI

    Wahid

  • http://www.bahairants.com Baquia

    Wahid,
    I’m weighing in on this (with my considerable mass) against everyone, Baha’i, atheist, sentient, carbon-based, or not. You didn’t start with the insults, which I appreciate, but until I notice things please hold off on reciprocating in kind. I am not able to monitor comments 24/7 but try to be on the ball. Although I hate to censor or remove comments I am forced to do so and have in this example removed the insults.

    I ask for everyone’s equanimity until I arrive on the scene. And it would warm the cockles of my heart (they are normally quite frigid) to not even have to step in.

    Thank you :)

  • http://www.bahairants.com Baquia

    Wahid,
    I’m weighing in on this (with my considerable mass) against everyone, Baha’i, atheist, sentient, carbon-based, or not. You didn’t start with the insults, which I appreciate, but until I notice things please hold off on reciprocating in kind. I am not able to monitor comments 24/7 but try to be on the ball. Although I hate to censor or remove comments I am forced to do so and have in this example removed the insults.

    I ask for everyone’s equanimity until I arrive on the scene. And it would warm the cockles of my heart (they are normally quite frigid) to not even have to step in.

    Thank you :)

  • annoymouz

    [quote comment=""]Stay tuned, folks, as we begin to reveal here the various funding, political and Washington-based PAC (political action committee) big-lobby connections to several of the people mentioned sitting above on that board. Especially interesing here is how you have two Israelis and one American Jew whose name is eerily similar to a certain AIPAC (American-Israeli Public Affairs Committee) coordinating director serving on the board of a network whose immediate subsidiary is the organization calling its MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHA’I RIGHTS.

    Annonymouz, can you say ?WAG THE DOG’ ?[/quote]

    Frankly Nima you can think whatever you want. They do good work for many groups, bringing attention to niche causes seems to be their specialty. Enough said. Moreover, if you visit their frontpage at mideastyouth.com they have a small widget that shows their current fundraising…some $600. Big Jewish money? Hardly.

  • annoymouz

    [quote comment=""]Stay tuned, folks, as we begin to reveal here the various funding, political and Washington-based PAC (political action committee) big-lobby connections to several of the people mentioned sitting above on that board. Especially interesing here is how you have two Israelis and one American Jew whose name is eerily similar to a certain AIPAC (American-Israeli Public Affairs Committee) coordinating director serving on the board of a network whose immediate subsidiary is the organization calling its MUSLIM NETWORK FOR BAHA’I RIGHTS.

    Annonymouz, can you say ?WAG THE DOG’ ?[/quote]

    Frankly Nima you can think whatever you want. They do good work for many groups, bringing attention to niche causes seems to be their specialty. Enough said. Moreover, if you visit their frontpage at mideastyouth.com they have a small widget that shows their current fundraising…some $600. Big Jewish money? Hardly.

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]

    Frankly Nima you can think whatever you want. They do good work for many groups, bringing attention to niche causes seems to be their specialty. Enough said. Moreover, if you visit their frontpage at mideastyouth.com they have a small widget that shows their current fundraising…some $600..[/quote]

    You were saying before that they are based in Pakistan. When your claim was proven to be categorically false, you now rehearse a SOB story about this organization being broke. Let’s look at one of the board members of the MidEastYouth and their donation record to various “humanitarian” causes, i.e. Mr Mohammad Memarian,
    http://209.85.173.132/search?q=cache:qwkDSvw9hxoJ:www.iman.org/Earth%2520Quake%2520Donations.pdf+%22Mohammad+Memarian%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=11&gl=au&client=firefox-a

    In December 2004 Mr Memarian charged his credit card on one single transaction donating to an earthquake relief cause to the tune of $194,200.00 U$D ON A SINGLE DONATION. Lest you miss the point, this was one single, lump-sum donation to a single charity! The record shows his other transactions right before it to the same thing as $56,808.00, $42, 610.00 and on down. Kindly peruse the table for your edification. This is all public information.

    Mr Mohammad Memarian must have some very busy accountants, and he himself must have some amazing liquidity and assets at his disposal to be able to afford to throw around money like that. But one thing that is for darn sure, the MidEastYouth is not remotely tied for cash by any stretch of the imaginatrion with a board member such as Mr Mohammad Memarian, let alone to be broke!

    Sorry, your SOB story sounds awfully like the kind of misdirecting institutional-beggary of the uhj back in the 1980s and 1990s when it continually claimed it was nearly broke for certain projects, like its temple in India and Arc, when it wasn’t, but went around putting its hand out squeezing and milking yet more money from its community anyway. In Persian we call this gedaa’ee/beggary! And what this organization is doing claiming it is broke and getting individuals to donate to it when it has Mr Mohammad Memarian sitting on its board, is exactly that: gedaa’ee/beggary!

    As for what MidEastYouth actually does. Frankly, it does nothing that isn’t already done by others far better and far more genuinely. One thing that it does do and has done so far is to act as a covert Zionist propaganda front for various interests that – until this afternoon Washington EST when Obama took the oath of office – were hell bent on initiating a war against Iran. I am, of course, referring to the fraudulent (or, rather, interpolated) statement attributed to the dissident cleric Ayatollah Hossein-Ali Montazeri claiming to recognize Bahaism and argued for extending rights unilaterally to Bahais on the basis of their religio, when he said nothing remotely of the sort and the records of his website show it.

    Now how about that broke MidEastYouth with only $600.00 in its account! I think I speak for everyone here that if we were each a charity or some organization, all of us would pray we were strapped for cash on Mohammad Memarian’s watch!

    WAHID

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]

    Frankly Nima you can think whatever you want. They do good work for many groups, bringing attention to niche causes seems to be their specialty. Enough said. Moreover, if you visit their frontpage at mideastyouth.com they have a small widget that shows their current fundraising…some $600..[/quote]

    You were saying before that they are based in Pakistan. When your claim was proven to be categorically false, you now rehearse a SOB story about this organization being broke. Let’s look at one of the board members of the MidEastYouth and their donation record to various “humanitarian” causes, i.e. Mr Mohammad Memarian,
    http://209.85.173.132/search?q=cache:qwkDSvw9hxoJ:www.iman.org/Earth%2520Quake%2520Donations.pdf+%22Mohammad+Memarian%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=11&gl=au&client=firefox-a

    In December 2004 Mr Memarian charged his credit card on one single transaction donating to an earthquake relief cause to the tune of $194,200.00 U$D ON A SINGLE DONATION. Lest you miss the point, this was one single, lump-sum donation to a single charity! The record shows his other transactions right before it to the same thing as $56,808.00, $42, 610.00 and on down. Kindly peruse the table for your edification. This is all public information.

    Mr Mohammad Memarian must have some very busy accountants, and he himself must have some amazing liquidity and assets at his disposal to be able to afford to throw around money like that. But one thing that is for darn sure, the MidEastYouth is not remotely tied for cash by any stretch of the imaginatrion with a board member such as Mr Mohammad Memarian, let alone to be broke!

    Sorry, your SOB story sounds awfully like the kind of misdirecting institutional-beggary of the uhj back in the 1980s and 1990s when it continually claimed it was nearly broke for certain projects, like its temple in India and Arc, when it wasn’t, but went around putting its hand out squeezing and milking yet more money from its community anyway. In Persian we call this gedaa’ee/beggary! And what this organization is doing claiming it is broke and getting individuals to donate to it when it has Mr Mohammad Memarian sitting on its board, is exactly that: gedaa’ee/beggary!

    As for what MidEastYouth actually does. Frankly, it does nothing that isn’t already done by others far better and far more genuinely. One thing that it does do and has done so far is to act as a covert Zionist propaganda front for various interests that – until this afternoon Washington EST when Obama took the oath of office – were hell bent on initiating a war against Iran. I am, of course, referring to the fraudulent (or, rather, interpolated) statement attributed to the dissident cleric Ayatollah Hossein-Ali Montazeri claiming to recognize Bahaism and argued for extending rights unilaterally to Bahais on the basis of their religio, when he said nothing remotely of the sort and the records of his website show it.

    Now how about that broke MidEastYouth with only $600.00 in its account! I think I speak for everyone here that if we were each a charity or some organization, all of us would pray we were strapped for cash on Mohammad Memarian’s watch!

    WAHID

  • annonymouz

    NIMA, PLEASE CHECK INTO A PSYCH WARD. SERIOUSLY. YOU ARE SO FAR INTO A CONSPIRATORIAL FIT THAT FRANKLY I HAVE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE IT.

    You are simply delusional in the purest psychiatric sense of the word.

    Seek help. I mean this in as serious a tone as possible. For you to use that link as a proof goes to show how hell bent you are on proving anything that anyone says that does not agree with you.

    If you would have read the form carefully it does not say “charged to” it says “charged by” meaning that mr memarian was helping facilitate money transfers in batches. Not paying with his own credit card!! Look at the form and it shows many batches that mohammad helped process, among others as well.

    Read it again.

    If you read Mideastyouth at all you would recognize mr memarian is only in his 20s and helps with translations. He lives in Iran.

    Besides…that is not the same Mohammad Memarian.

  • annonymouz

    NIMA, PLEASE CHECK INTO A PSYCH WARD. SERIOUSLY. YOU ARE SO FAR INTO A CONSPIRATORIAL FIT THAT FRANKLY I HAVE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE IT.

    You are simply delusional in the purest psychiatric sense of the word.

    Seek help. I mean this in as serious a tone as possible. For you to use that link as a proof goes to show how hell bent you are on proving anything that anyone says that does not agree with you.

    If you would have read the form carefully it does not say “charged to” it says “charged by” meaning that mr memarian was helping facilitate money transfers in batches. Not paying with his own credit card!! Look at the form and it shows many batches that mohammad helped process, among others as well.

    Read it again.

    If you read Mideastyouth at all you would recognize mr memarian is only in his 20s and helps with translations. He lives in Iran.

    Besides…that is not the same Mohammad Memarian.

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]NIMA, PLEASE CHECK INTO A PSYCH WARD. SERIOUSLY. YOU ARE SO FAR INTO A CONSPIRATORIAL FIT THAT FRANKLY I HAVE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE IT.

    You are simply delusional in the purest psychiatric sense of the word.

    Seek help. I mean this in as serious a tone as possible. For you to use that link as a proof goes to show how hell bent you are on proving anything that anyone says that does not agree with you.

    If you would have read the form carefully it does not say “charged to” it says “charged by” meaning that mr memarian was helping facilitate money transfers in batches. Not paying with his own credit card!! Look at the form and it shows many batches that mohammad helped process, among others as well.

    Read it again.

    If you read Mideastyouth at all you would recognize mr memarian is only in his 20s and helps with translations. He lives in Iran.[/quote]

    It is pretty obvious that the one needing institutionalization is yourself and the assorted membership of your cult – and not just in a psychiatric ward. I have step by step proven every last one of your assertions to be fraudulent. I have provided prima facie evidence of the finances of one member of the MidEastYouth board which categorically refutes your claim that this organization would be under financial strain. You obviously have nothing to say to such irrefutable evidence of the general deceit and scam-artistry that is this front organization you’re shamelessly defending here.

    Case shut. You have absolutely lost the argument and proven all my points.

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]NIMA, PLEASE CHECK INTO A PSYCH WARD. SERIOUSLY. YOU ARE SO FAR INTO A CONSPIRATORIAL FIT THAT FRANKLY I HAVE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE IT.

    You are simply delusional in the purest psychiatric sense of the word.

    Seek help. I mean this in as serious a tone as possible. For you to use that link as a proof goes to show how hell bent you are on proving anything that anyone says that does not agree with you.

    If you would have read the form carefully it does not say “charged to” it says “charged by” meaning that mr memarian was helping facilitate money transfers in batches. Not paying with his own credit card!! Look at the form and it shows many batches that mohammad helped process, among others as well.

    Read it again.

    If you read Mideastyouth at all you would recognize mr memarian is only in his 20s and helps with translations. He lives in Iran.[/quote]

    It is pretty obvious that the one needing institutionalization is yourself and the assorted membership of your cult – and not just in a psychiatric ward. I have step by step proven every last one of your assertions to be fraudulent. I have provided prima facie evidence of the finances of one member of the MidEastYouth board which categorically refutes your claim that this organization would be under financial strain. You obviously have nothing to say to such irrefutable evidence of the general deceit and scam-artistry that is this front organization you’re shamelessly defending here.

    Case shut. You have absolutely lost the argument and proven all my points.

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    BS! They are one and the same person.

    Wahid

  • http://bahaisonline.net/tcb Steve Marshall

    Wahid said:
    [quote comment=""]I think I speak for everyone here[/quote]

    I’m sure you do.

  • http://bahaisonline.net/tcb Steve Marshall

    Wahid said:
    [quote comment=""]I think I speak for everyone here[/quote]

    I’m sure you do.

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]Wahid said:
    [quote comment=""]I think I speak for everyone here[/quote]

    I’m sure you do.[/quote]

    Apparently a lot more than you do, Comrade Marshall. BTW in your below-the-belt responses to Reza on the ex-bahai list claiming that taqiyyah does not exist in Bahaism, you must’ve forgotten about the following:

    http://bahai-library.com/bsr/bsr06/62_maneck_hikmat.htm
    Wisdom and dissimulation:
    The use and meaning of Hikmat in the Bah??’? writings and history

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]Wahid said:
    [quote comment=""]I think I speak for everyone here[/quote]

    I’m sure you do.[/quote]

    Apparently a lot more than you do, Comrade Marshall. BTW in your below-the-belt responses to Reza on the ex-bahai list claiming that taqiyyah does not exist in Bahaism, you must’ve forgotten about the following:

    http://bahai-library.com/bsr/bsr06/62_maneck_hikmat.htm
    Wisdom and dissimulation:
    The use and meaning of Hikmat in the Bah??’? writings and history

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]annonymouz said:
    If you read Mideastyouth at all you would recognize mr memarian is only in his 20s and helps with translations.
    [/quote]

    And this is coming from the same person who earlier was claiming that this MidEastYouth organization functions out of Pakistan! LOL!!
    The worth of your statements are nil. As is common practice in your cult, you people will lie about anything. You even have your distinguished scholar Susan Maneck saying so in print. But note there was a Bahai member of the Memarian family who in 2003-2004 was specifically accused of espionage in Iran. Yes, a *Bahai*. Some relative of Mohammad Memamarian apparently, the same Mohammad Memarian who can afford to charge 140,000.00+ U$D on his credit card as one of several donations to an earthquake fund. The one and the same Mohammad Memarian who sits on the board of MidEastYouth.

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]annonymouz said:
    If you read Mideastyouth at all you would recognize mr memarian is only in his 20s and helps with translations.
    [/quote]

    And this is coming from the same person who earlier was claiming that this MidEastYouth organization functions out of Pakistan! LOL!!
    The worth of your statements are nil. As is common practice in your cult, you people will lie about anything. You even have your distinguished scholar Susan Maneck saying so in print. But note there was a Bahai member of the Memarian family who in 2003-2004 was specifically accused of espionage in Iran. Yes, a *Bahai*. Some relative of Mohammad Memamarian apparently, the same Mohammad Memarian who can afford to charge 140,000.00+ U$D on his credit card as one of several donations to an earthquake fund. The one and the same Mohammad Memarian who sits on the board of MidEastYouth.

    Wahid

  • maybeIam

    Certain people who have taken to questioning Wahid’s sanity need to have a long, serious think about their perspective, and understand that there are others out there keeping a sharp eye on things. And they (along with Wahid) are very, very sane indeed.

    Mr Omid Townsend, Legal Advisor to Mid-East Youth is a Baha’i:

    http://www.wiretapmag.org/warandpeace/43308/

    “But it’s not just a forum for discussion, says Persian-American and Bahai Omid Townsend, the legal advisor for Mideast Youth. “We are a medium of change and an outlet for places and people to voice their opinions in areas where they may otherwise not be able to,” he says.”

    Whilst it is claimed that they fund themselves on very little money, they have received grants from known conservative ‘think tank’ funders, Atlas Economic Research Foundation- a foundation whose supporters include Exxon and Phillip Morris tobacco (http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Atlas_Economic_Research_Foundation)

    (again from http://www.wiretapmag.org/warandpeace/43308/)

    “The organization places a lot of importance on its ability to remain independent. The staff funds itself on very little money, which comes from staff members themselves, reader donations and online advertisements. In May 2007, Mideast Youth received a $5,000 award from the Atlas Economic Research Foundation for “New Intellectual Entrepreneurship Project.” The staff used the prize money to add a gallery, petition system and a video site to its online endeavors.”

    Regarding Atals Economic Research Foundation. Note well, its founders so called “lifelong campaign” to combat “creeping socialism”.

    http://www.prwatch.org/prwissues/2004Q3/atlas.html

    Briton Antony Fisher founded Atlas as part of his lifelong campaign to influence the “climate of ideas” and combat “creeping socialism.” Atlas credits Fisher with assisting in the early stages of development of several conservative think tanks, including the Manhattan Institute, Pacific Research Institute in San Francisco and Fraser Institute in Vancouver, Canada.

    Atlas identifies, screens and offers initial support to individuals and groups who want to create local think tanks. “Our ideal ‘intellectual entrepreneur,’” says Atlas, is “someone who communicates effectively with businessmen, academicians and the general public.” By facilitating the establishment of local think tanks, Atlas increases both the reach and local credibility of their “free market” message, thereby having “the most cost-effective impact.”

    “Since its formation in 1981, Atlas has funnelled over $20 million in grants to think tanks that have passed its screening process. Atlas aims, it says, to “increase that amount tenfold in the next decade.” In 2003, a little over $2 million of Atlas’s budget was passed on to other think tanks. While large conservative foundations often make sizable, sustained and general support grants, Atlas believes less is more, giving small grants of $5,000 or less. Atlas then weans fledgling projects off this modest annual funding within five years, making exception only for specific innovative projects.”

    See also http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Atlas_Economic_Research_Foundation

    Known corporate donors include ExxonMobil, which according to the Greenpeace website ExxonSecrets.org., has contributed over $500,000 since 1998. Exxon itself discloses contributions of $65,000 in 1998 (then Exxon) [3] and $50,000 during 2002. [4]

    In a May 1998 fundraising pitch to tobacco giant Phillip Morris, Chaufen explained that keeping its think tanks off the dole of political parties, universities, government agencies and lobbies “helps keep their ideas and recommendations untainted by real or perceived political or organizational ties” and “helps protect them and us against potential scandal. Think tanks tied to politicians and parties can easily become instruments of corruption. Indeed, in several instances, public officials have enriched themselves and their allies through the ‘think tanks’ they control,” Chaufen wrote.[5]

  • maybeIam

    Certain people who have taken to questioning Wahid’s sanity need to have a long, serious think about their perspective, and understand that there are others out there keeping a sharp eye on things. And they (along with Wahid) are very, very sane indeed.

    Mr Omid Townsend, Legal Advisor to Mid-East Youth is a Baha’i:

    http://www.wiretapmag.org/warandpeace/43308/

    “But it’s not just a forum for discussion, says Persian-American and Bahai Omid Townsend, the legal advisor for Mideast Youth. “We are a medium of change and an outlet for places and people to voice their opinions in areas where they may otherwise not be able to,” he says.”

    Whilst it is claimed that they fund themselves on very little money, they have received grants from known conservative ‘think tank’ funders, Atlas Economic Research Foundation- a foundation whose supporters include Exxon and Phillip Morris tobacco (http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Atlas_Economic_Research_Foundation)

    (again from http://www.wiretapmag.org/warandpeace/43308/)

    “The organization places a lot of importance on its ability to remain independent. The staff funds itself on very little money, which comes from staff members themselves, reader donations and online advertisements. In May 2007, Mideast Youth received a $5,000 award from the Atlas Economic Research Foundation for “New Intellectual Entrepreneurship Project.” The staff used the prize money to add a gallery, petition system and a video site to its online endeavors.”

    Regarding Atals Economic Research Foundation. Note well, its founders so called “lifelong campaign” to combat “creeping socialism”.

    http://www.prwatch.org/prwissues/2004Q3/atlas.html

    Briton Antony Fisher founded Atlas as part of his lifelong campaign to influence the “climate of ideas” and combat “creeping socialism.” Atlas credits Fisher with assisting in the early stages of development of several conservative think tanks, including the Manhattan Institute, Pacific Research Institute in San Francisco and Fraser Institute in Vancouver, Canada.

    Atlas identifies, screens and offers initial support to individuals and groups who want to create local think tanks. “Our ideal ‘intellectual entrepreneur,’” says Atlas, is “someone who communicates effectively with businessmen, academicians and the general public.” By facilitating the establishment of local think tanks, Atlas increases both the reach and local credibility of their “free market” message, thereby having “the most cost-effective impact.”

    “Since its formation in 1981, Atlas has funnelled over $20 million in grants to think tanks that have passed its screening process. Atlas aims, it says, to “increase that amount tenfold in the next decade.” In 2003, a little over $2 million of Atlas’s budget was passed on to other think tanks. While large conservative foundations often make sizable, sustained and general support grants, Atlas believes less is more, giving small grants of $5,000 or less. Atlas then weans fledgling projects off this modest annual funding within five years, making exception only for specific innovative projects.”

    See also http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Atlas_Economic_Research_Foundation

    Known corporate donors include ExxonMobil, which according to the Greenpeace website ExxonSecrets.org., has contributed over $500,000 since 1998. Exxon itself discloses contributions of $65,000 in 1998 (then Exxon) [3] and $50,000 during 2002. [4]

    In a May 1998 fundraising pitch to tobacco giant Phillip Morris, Chaufen explained that keeping its think tanks off the dole of political parties, universities, government agencies and lobbies “helps keep their ideas and recommendations untainted by real or perceived political or organizational ties” and “helps protect them and us against potential scandal. Think tanks tied to politicians and parties can easily become instruments of corruption. Indeed, in several instances, public officials have enriched themselves and their allies through the ‘think tanks’ they control,” Chaufen wrote.[5]

  • http://bahaisonline.net/tcb Steve Marshall

    [quote comment="61240"]…in your below-the-belt responses to Reza on the ex-bahai list claiming that taqiyyah does not exist in Bahaism,[/quote]

    As I said to Reza, “You’re mistaken. I have been silent on that particular issue.”

    [quote comment="61240"]you must’ve forgotten about the following:[/quote]

    True, and I may have a look at that, now you mention it, but I don’t have a lot of time for Susan.

    You’ll forgive me if I refrain from responding to any further off-topic ad homs.

    tk,
    Steve

  • http://bahaisonline.net/tcb Steve Marshall

    [quote comment="61240"]…in your below-the-belt responses to Reza on the ex-bahai list claiming that taqiyyah does not exist in Bahaism,[/quote]

    As I said to Reza, “You’re mistaken. I have been silent on that particular issue.”

    [quote comment="61240"]you must’ve forgotten about the following:[/quote]

    True, and I may have a look at that, now you mention it, but I don’t have a lot of time for Susan.

    You’ll forgive me if I refrain from responding to any further off-topic ad homs.

    tk,
    Steve

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    To Steve Marshall.

    What you’ve said to Reza is pure bunkum, whatever time you have or don’t have for Susan Maneck. After all, she’s not making anything up in the paper she wrote about taqiyya/hikmat in Bahaism. If you have a problem with the sources or trajectory of discussion with Reza on this question, you can always come to TRB or any other forum where you don’t get to manipulate content and get to censor and control who posts, and debate me personally in public on the question – and please, by all means, bring Sen McGlinn and whoever else you wish with you.

    As for my ad homs directed your way, obviously they don’t have enough to pay you for your deliberations thereunto. But here is a question, an individual who is a career librarian and lives in the south Island of New Zealand in a totally white, redneck town such as Dunedin has an awful lot of time on their hands to be acting the AO-cratic irritant all over the net towards anyone who doesn’t tow party lines, on the one hand; not to mention cares an awful lot regarding a people, the politics and culture of Iran and Iranians that he has absolutely no contact or personal connection to (nor ever has) whatsoever, on the other. What gives?

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    To Steve Marshall.

    What you’ve said to Reza is pure bunkum, whatever time you have or don’t have for Susan Maneck. After all, she’s not making anything up in the paper she wrote about taqiyya/hikmat in Bahaism. If you have a problem with the sources or trajectory of discussion with Reza on this question, you can always come to TRB or any other forum where you don’t get to manipulate content and get to censor and control who posts, and debate me personally in public on the question – and please, by all means, bring Sen McGlinn and whoever else you wish with you.

    As for my ad homs directed your way, obviously they don’t have enough to pay you for your deliberations thereunto. But here is a question, an individual who is a career librarian and lives in the south Island of New Zealand in a totally white, redneck town such as Dunedin has an awful lot of time on their hands to be acting the AO-cratic irritant all over the net towards anyone who doesn’t tow party lines, on the one hand; not to mention cares an awful lot regarding a people, the politics and culture of Iran and Iranians that he has absolutely no contact or personal connection to (nor ever has) whatsoever, on the other. What gives?

    Wahid

  • annonymouz

    Nima,

    your homework has dug up some interesting things. I would like to apologize for calling you insane. I am not a doctor. However, if you aim is to somehow discredit mideastyouth I am afraid that the “proof” you bring here is nothing more than evidence of their good work.

    So what if they receive a grant here or there. Its common practice for big corporations to give to institutes. Its a tax write off to them and a boost for different causes.

  • annonymouz

    Nima,

    your homework has dug up some interesting things. I would like to apologize for calling you insane. I am not a doctor. However, if you aim is to somehow discredit mideastyouth I am afraid that the “proof” you bring here is nothing more than evidence of their good work.

    So what if they receive a grant here or there. Its common practice for big corporations to give to institutes. Its a tax write off to them and a boost for different causes.

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    Why was the previous comment here just erased from the board? Wahid

    Author: maybeIam

    [Mod: no, look above and you will see it]

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]So what if they receive a grant here or there. Its common practice for big corporations to give to institutes. Its a tax write off to them and a boost for different causes.[/quote]

    Thank you for this admission and gem of a quote. You will be quoted on it. Perhaps in your money-and-god driven cult universe that is the Haifan Bahaim organization practices of taking money from organizations with pre-established political agendas is alright. After all such funds are specifically designed towards specific political ends. It was definitely the modus operandi of the past 8 years under the Neo-Con regime of terror, and it is exactly the manner in which you Bahaim were given a free ride through various think-tanks and the office of the former vice-president Dick Cheney to pursue their global hackery and vendetta against the government and people of Iran, or political enemies generally speaking. As of noon Washington EST this all ended for the forseable future.

    Now with Obama in – and given the stringent directives he just passed today as executive orders limiting lobbyist influence on the new administration – the free ride and lobbyist directed policy making by proxy initiatives that your cult has been vigorously engaged in since 2001 (together with the dudd organizations and fronts you have set-up through your global money laundering) will soon be under wide scrutiny, and eventually *prosecution*.

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    [quote comment=""]So what if they receive a grant here or there. Its common practice for big corporations to give to institutes. Its a tax write off to them and a boost for different causes.[/quote]

    Thank you for this admission and gem of a quote. You will be quoted on it. Perhaps in your money-and-god driven cult universe that is the Haifan Bahaim organization practices of taking money from organizations with pre-established political agendas is alright. After all such funds are specifically designed towards specific political ends. It was definitely the modus operandi of the past 8 years under the Neo-Con regime of terror, and it is exactly the manner in which you Bahaim were given a free ride through various think-tanks and the office of the former vice-president Dick Cheney to pursue their global hackery and vendetta against the government and people of Iran, or political enemies generally speaking. As of noon Washington EST this all ended for the forseable future.

    Now with Obama in – and given the stringent directives he just passed today as executive orders limiting lobbyist influence on the new administration – the free ride and lobbyist directed policy making by proxy initiatives that your cult has been vigorously engaged in since 2001 (together with the dudd organizations and fronts you have set-up through your global money laundering) will soon be under wide scrutiny, and eventually *prosecution*.

    Wahid

  • http://www.wahidazal.com Wahid Azal

    http://www.swans.com/library/art14/barker04.html

    25. United Jewish Communities is an organizational member of the Save Darfur Coalition, and a member of IsraAID — which was founded in 2001 and describes itself as a “coordinating body of Israeli and Jewish NGOs (non governmental organizations) and other interested parties based in Israel that are active in development and relief work and concerned about global issues (‘Tikkun Olam’).” In 2002, Henry Elkaslasi, the head of The Humanitarian Fund of the Kibbutz Movement, became chair of IsraAID. Elkaslasi presently also serves as the co-chair of the Israeli Coalition for the Refugees of Darfur and Sudan (also known as Israel for Darfur). Israel for Darfur is listed as a campaign of the blogging group, Darfur Awareness, which in turn is a project of a group called Mideast Youth. This latter group was founded by Esra’a Al Shafei — who also cofounded the Middle East Interfaith Blogger Network — and in June 2007, she received an award from free-market Atlas Economic Research Foundation for her Mideast Youth project. (back)

  • David

    The American NSA sent a message dated two days ago that said the seven Bahai leaders arrested in Iran last year will be put on trial next week for “espionage for Israel, insulting religious sanctities and propaganda against the Islamic Republic.”

    The NSA asks we:

    ? Hold your own prayer gatherings for the safety of the Friends in Iran.

    ? Organize prayer gatherings in your community, in consultation with your Local Spiritual Assembly, as soon as possible for the safety of the Iranian Bah??’? leaders and for the amelioration of the deplorable situation of religious freedom in Iran. These gatherings should be open to the public and the members of your local media should be invited. Reach out to your Christian, Jewish and Muslim friends, and to your interfaith groups, as well as to all those concerned about religious freedom in Iran. The main purpose of such
    gatherings is for prayer, and it is essential that they should uphold and exemplify the Bah??’? standard of non-involvement in partisan politics. Discussion on matters outside the scope of religious freedom and human rights should be strictly avoided.

    ? Contact your federal Congressional Representatives from both the House of Representatives and the Senate, by telephone or email, or in person at their district offices. Express to them or their staff your deep concern for the Iranian Bah??’? leaders whose lives are in danger. Most of the members of Congress will be in their home districts the week of February 15, as there is a Congressional recess at that time.

    I want to start by saying that we should pray for the safety of these seven Bahai’s. I also want to point out that this is a clear example of what I wrote about a few weeks ago concerning Bahai’s and the Bahai Administration usually speaking up and urging action only when Bahai’s are the victims. There was not one official word (that I’m aware of) from the UHJ or any NSA concerning Israel’s attacks on Gaza. It is interesting that the NSA thinks it is possible for Bahai’s to protest the treatment of other Bahai’s by a foreign government without it being involvement in partisan politics. But when it comes to protesting the military attacks launched by the country which is home to the world center of the Bahai Faith, all is quiet. And not only are Bahai’s now supposed to speak up, we’re to contact the media and invite them to our prayer gatherings. And we’re to invite our Jewish, Christian, and Muslim friends too. So is it okay for us to join our Jewish friends when they ask us to pray and protest the bombing of Israel by Hamas? Or how about our Muslim and Christian friends who want us to pray and protest with them when Israel bombs Gaza? Or is it not an issue of “human rights” when people are killed in warfare?

  • David

    The American NSA sent a message dated two days ago that said the seven Bahai leaders arrested in Iran last year will be put on trial next week for “espionage for Israel, insulting religious sanctities and propaganda against the Islamic Republic.”

    The NSA asks we:

    ? Hold your own prayer gatherings for the safety of the Friends in Iran.

    ? Organize prayer gatherings in your community, in consultation with your Local Spiritual Assembly, as soon as possible for the safety of the Iranian Bah??’? leaders and for the amelioration of the deplorable situation of religious freedom in Iran. These gatherings should be open to the public and the members of your local media should be invited. Reach out to your Christian, Jewish and Muslim friends, and to your interfaith groups, as well as to all those concerned about religious freedom in Iran. The main purpose of such
    gatherings is for prayer, and it is essential that they should uphold and exemplify the Bah??’? standard of non-involvement in partisan politics. Discussion on matters outside the scope of religious freedom and human rights should be strictly avoided.

    ? Contact your federal Congressional Representatives from both the House of Representatives and the Senate, by telephone or email, or in person at their district offices. Express to them or their staff your deep concern for the Iranian Bah??’? leaders whose lives are in danger. Most of the members of Congress will be in their home districts the week of February 15, as there is a Congressional recess at that time.

    I want to start by saying that we should pray for the safety of these seven Bahai’s. I also want to point out that this is a clear example of what I wrote about a few weeks ago concerning Bahai’s and the Bahai Administration usually speaking up and urging action only when Bahai’s are the victims. There was not one official word (that I’m aware of) from the UHJ or any NSA concerning Israel’s attacks on Gaza. It is interesting that the NSA thinks it is possible for Bahai’s to protest the treatment of other Bahai’s by a foreign government without it being involvement in partisan politics. But when it comes to protesting the military attacks launched by the country which is home to the world center of the Bahai Faith, all is quiet. And not only are Bahai’s now supposed to speak up, we’re to contact the media and invite them to our prayer gatherings. And we’re to invite our Jewish, Christian, and Muslim friends too. So is it okay for us to join our Jewish friends when they ask us to pray and protest the bombing of Israel by Hamas? Or how about our Muslim and Christian friends who want us to pray and protest with them when Israel bombs Gaza? Or is it not an issue of “human rights” when people are killed in warfare?

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  • habibullah

    just go to hell like any other muhammadan muslim
    you bahislamists

  • habibullah

    just go to hell like any other muhammadan muslim
    you bahislamists

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  • optimist

    well we all now know, that hiefa based bahai organisation eventully lost
    the us case for good. Personally I think that is one of the best things that
    has happend to bahai faith on last 10 years. The self declared monopoloy of haifa based on bahai faith need to be broken. sooner or later all differing view on the faith need to be addressed and discussed in civilised and intelacutal manner rather than employing the mafia tactics and suppressing the disent by uhj. I am very much looking forward that bahais rather demand justice and unity rather follow the uhj like the sheeps.