If indeed I made a mistake, I made two. One was assuming that people actually read my posts with understanding; and two, that the best of us can avoid the personal in discussing concepts.

What was the concept in the rest of my previous post? Or is the important part really that I said that if you post on a blog (including this one) you can expect to get slammed?

In that post I offered an here-to-fore unheard of postulation. A solution to a dillema. The much discussed dillema of ‘obedience to the House of Justice’ and ‘objection to the tops down system’ of Baha’i’. Tops down is utilized by EVERY organization claiming to represent Baha’i.

Again I may be mistaken but I think the idea I pressented deserves at least a cursory examination. Baha’u'llah says it will bring peace to the world.

As for the gist of this thread? Building a Mashriq’ul-Adhkar in Chile and why that’s a bad idea, mini entrepreneurism and why thats a good idea, haifa aint getting MY money, There’s lots to do with thirty mill but this Mashriq’ul-Adhkar is still a good idea, we don’t know enough about the construct of Mashriq’ul-Adhkar to talk about it, Any way the chile thing is beautiful and should make sense to Chile not India, then my post with perhaps too many ramifications?? yours and here we are.

What is a Mashriq’ul-Adhkar?? Karen Baquet described it pretty well on one of her pages some time back. I pulled out everything I could find some time back and built an essay on one of my pages. It ain’t what most Baha’is think it is. Just a hint from AB “it is the dawning point for all things Baha’i”

Mashriq’ul-Adhkar consultation deserves a thread of it’s own Baquia. I don’t know how to start one of these web sites or I would do it myself.

Robert Clifton

Have you actually read this blog? Or what most of the posters actually have to say? Criticizing “top-down management” is what our host, Baquia, and most of us are constantly doing. If you took the time to read the posts you’d see that. And as for criticizing the House, we do that too much. There are at least two blog entries dedicated to questioning whether the House can really be infallible in the way that some people seem to think. I’ve posted links to my satirical story ridiculing the vulgar-minded interpretation of infallibility and others have commented as well.

How you could imagine we’re a bunch of apologists for “top-down management” or afraid to take issue with official policy is beyond me. You’d have to deliberately ignore the things we talk about. Or perhaps you’ve made a mistake and this posting was intended for some other list where people *are* afraid to criticize. In either case, you’ve misjudged this particular crowd.

About wasting 30 million dollars (or so.):
I wonder why those of us who have the ability to build these great forums and web sites waste our time beating individuals up over their choices instead of building web pages to educate. Then I remind myself - a big beautiful temple in the jungle shows the world how great my group is. Temples and web pages teach people for enerations how skilled I was. But it does not unite all religions in the worship of one God.

Does this web page educate? I think it more entrenches. Watch the posters rally around the tops down management of the UHJ and the ohh so common ostentious display of power.
I realise I just stepped into the ring with my gloves on so I expect to get hit. Just don’t hit below the belt! I’ve built a web page at Englishnative where I offer free classes.

Robert Clifton
Local House of Justice of Carbondale, Illinois

As beautiful as it is, it does seem to borrow heavily from the Indian Temple without any grass roots attempts to arrive at something which would make sense for Chile and its people, not India.

Am I missing something here? This structure being built in Chile is a Mashriqu’l-Adhkar, but you’d rather see more money go into building a Mashriqu’l-Adhkar?

Anyway… I know this fact won’t appease you, as it seems like there are better things to do with 30 Mil. But maybe it makes it slightly more palatable to know that the quote from the Guardian you cited is actually talking about the very thing being constructed in Chile.

It may not make immediate sense to you, but at least the money is going where he says it should be going.

“The financial implications of this enterprise present the Bahá’í world with a new challenge. Total cost of the project is estimated at twenty-seven million dollars, and the plans now call for its completion within a period of three years. It is vital that the flow of contributions to the already established Chilean Temple Fund be greatly increased to ensure full support to the work. The friends everywhere are called upon to seize the opportunity to contribute sacrificially to an undertaking that holds immense promise for the advancement of the Cause and has already been the object of marvellous confirmations.”

So we’re supposed to “seize the opportunity to contribute sacrifically,” much as we did for the Arc Project. In addition, of course, to contributing “sacrificially” to the Kingdom Project, the National Fund, the Continental Fund, the International Fund, the local funds, and, of course, Huquq’u'llah.

One question, please.

WHERE THE HELL IS ALL THE MONEY GOING???

It sure isn’t improving anyone’s life around here…sure, we have some nice gardens in Haifa, and some nice big buildings in Haifa, and some temples around the world. I’m sure Robert C. Henderson is being well taken care of (he sure doesn’t buy those tailored suits with the profits from his failed business), and the UHJ has no worries in that department, but we’ve closed Landegg and the Home for the Aged and there are no replacements in sight. There’s some “marvellous confirmations” for you.

But we’re supposed to contribute “sacrificially.”

And “seize the opportunity.”

(Hey, Haifa: Seize this!)

Methinks they can go to hell.