One has no authority to tell another what they should think. It is so much up to the individual to *search* for an understanding. Flawed as we are, we are only too fallible. That is why a search is important, not a conquest to push your ideas, but a conquest to understand and respect.

Well said, Wullin, I fully agree

with so many problems in the world, why create more. With evil doers never resting, how can one, interested in the welfare of the world ever stop to contribute to the negative forces wrecking this world?

It does not matter so much what religion, what thought of belief, as much as the underlying intent matters. To work for the betterment of the world, for peace unity, that is what’s important.

One has no authority to tell another what they should think. It is so much up to the individual to *search* for an understanding. Flawed as we are, we are only too fallible. That is why a search is important, not a conquest to push your ideas, but a conquest to understand and respect.

well I guess you haven’t been around Persian Bahais much have you? As an Iranian Bahai, who happens to be gay, I know how easily someone in my situation could be ostrasized by family and others. I just chose to keep myself inactive from the Bahai community instead of dealing with their scourge. But I still have my insistant Persian Bahai mother trying to force me back into activities. Oh yeah, sure no pressures in the Bahai community, pleeeze; you must have your head stuck in the sand Carmen.

Sorry, CoL for the muddle; yes, I admit that your quote can lead some Baha’is to disdain for non-Baha’is, atheists and ex-Baha’is, and Baha’is not sharing their views. I actually remember some rare bigotted Baha’is attached to such concepts.

There is the spirit of the faith and the words that apply to specific situations; the injunctions to love and forebearance are abundant in all religions, but some hang on to the few passages that are an alibi for their unmitigated hatred. The Grand Inquisitor passage in Karamazov brothers is a perfect study of bigotry.

As far as I am concerned, when I look at my origins, I have absolutely no doubt that without the Baha’i Faith I would be a far worst and more intolerant person than I am now. I have no doubt that for me that Baha’i Faith has been a source progress, but I am sure that many have passed far beyond my condition through other sources.

I remember a tablet of Abdu’l-baha praising the non-Baha’i Westa and musing on the effects of Baha’u'llah’s revelation had it first appeared in the West.

My point goes beyond personnal virtues: my belief is that there is no other force capable of harmonising the contending cultures and nations such as backward bigots amongst which I was born and open minded atheists, other than the Baha’i Faith. I do not believe that passivity or violent confrontation are the keys to harmony.

You’ve misattributed my remark to Andrew.

I wouldn’t conflate Baha’u’llah’s use of the Evil One with the ungodly inasmuch as the former, popularly understood, refers to the baser dimension of human nature.
Baha’u’llah is quite clear and unequivocal about his attitude towards atheists, as illustrated by the following passage:

Know thou for a certainty that whoso disbelieveth in God is neither trustworthy nor truthful. This, indeed, is the truth, the undoubted truth. He that acteth treacherously towards God will, also, act treacherously towards his king. Nothing whatever can deter such a man from evil, nothing can hinder him from betraying his neighbor, nothing can induce him to walk uprightly.
(Baha’u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha’u'llah, p. 232)

Baha’u’llah is clearly identifying atheism with immorality.

Farhan, as a devout Bahai, will you not admit that such a passage can prejudice your view of atheists? Do you not see how this can motivate Bahai disdain for and suspicion of Bahais who exit the Faith and opt for atheism? Is it consistent for a Bahai to affirm the truth of the above passage while also engaging atheists, whether formerly Bahai or not? Do you not see how writings like this can compel Bahais to view any attempt by ex-Bahais or atheists at articulating their objections and challenges to the Faith as “hindering the rise and obstructing the spiritual progress of the children of men”?

Andrew, we do have bigots amongst the Baha’is, and I do not doubt personal experiences as the ones described here, but do I confirm what Carmen said : someone who leaves the Faith has _never_ in my long experience been shunned or ostracized. On the contrary, it is made clear that they would be welcome as friends whenever they wish to come, but those who leave the Baha’i Faith usually express the wish to be left alone and Baha’is fully respect this wish.

The writings do encourage fellowship with those “close to God” and discourage fellowship with the “ungodly” or “the evil one” but the definition of the “evil one” is not someone who leaves the Faith for whatever reason, but someone who deliberately seeks to undermine the spiritual growth of others ; here are Baha’u’llah’s own definition of the “evil one” in the Gleanings :

“Watch over yourselves, for the Evil One is lying in wait, ready to entrap you. Gird yourselves against his wicked devices, and, led by the light of the name of the All-Seeing God, make your escape from the darkness that surroundeth you. Let your vision be world-embracing, rather than confined to your own self. The Evil One is he that hindereth the rise and obstructeth the spiritual progress of the children of men.”

My personnal experience on this blog has been a source of thought and research, and not of obstruction.

“The ease with which people can leave the Faith is an excellent indicator of the fact that it has no isolating mechanism which is a critical characteristic of cults (http://bahai-library.com/essays/cult.html ).”

I must share with you first hand there is no ease what-so-ever in the un enrollment process, that is unless you are a Bahà’í for 5 seconds. I labeled myself a Bahà’í for 14 years and loved every excruciating moment of it because I thought I had found the closest thing on the planet that revealed G-d’s desires for myself and humanity. Hook line and sinker from the moment I heard the words…

But from that moment I was set on a path to conform through my own personal drive and that of the AO, of which I have posted previous statements of early on gentle slaps on the hand for questioning anything past certain points, I lived in stride, still do.

The demise of my relationship with the religion of the Bahà’í Faith began actually over a several year period of frustration with the lack of organization of the community I belonged to, but it was not the community who made the religion, it was the words itself. Instead of steering forward into the recommended Ruhi courses, I studied the actual archived books on line, through approved sites It takes years to really form a picture when there are so many works to study and the saga goes way back. Beginning with the works of the Bab, Baha’u’llah, Abdul”Baha, Shoghi Effedni and the UHJ directives each year I was kept quite busy. None of that study was on covenant breakers. I was advised early on not to read anything on the subject. Avoid it at all cost.

Last year on line I was questioned how I felt about what happened to Mason Remey and I had no answer because I never studied him. All I knew was that he was a tormented soul. So I decided to find out who he really was and the moment I did I felt like I was doing something wrong, (possible form of mind control?) but I had to at least look at who this person was before I could comment. I headed straight to the Bahà’í Reference Library and from there I really saw the ugliest side of the Bahà’í Faith and understood why the subject is discouraged to look into. I knew at the end of my study that there is no way that I am a Bahà’í. With all the facts in place I would have never walked in the door. There has been no ease in this departure. Very few of the Bahà’í’s in my community really believe I am not a Bahà’í but I am in a “test”. And those of any intelligence that know I have left are in fact steering very clear of me. I refuse to discuss the subject with anyone live, in that I choose not to harm the good in them with all the ugly I did find beneath there rose tinted glasses.

I assure you the Bahà’í Faith has lost more then they have kept that is if where I live is a micro example of the world there are many names still on the voting list who have requested to leave, no longer believe and have not come in the door in the 14 years I was there.

With the small victory of the Orthodox Bahà’í, I am sure within time there will be many versions of Bahà’í to choose from just like Christianity. I do hope you have a good job because as the economy hits it’s highs and people become confused who the “real Bahai’s” are, the poorest wont have any pennies to spare to keep the water flowing and electric bills paid.

I frankly do envision a day called the MGA, the Most Great Auction, of the Bahà’í properties in Haifa. I find no joy in the prospect of such. Unless the religion attracts members with means it can not support itself and it’s gilded cage. I have already read of centers closing and properties being sold. I am a real life CEO and when you start to sell off and downsizing it does not mean growth, it means reorganization or more free outsource such as members homes to maintain funds for the corporate structure.

Popcorn in the bowl, Dr. Pepper on ice…

Bird

I recently wrote this post on another site in support of someone who was reprimanded by BOTH his Christian friends and FELLOW Baha’is for calling “God” “Allah” even though the term is in Baha’u'llah’s OWN TITLE! Truly we are a “theocracy of dunces” on this amazing planet half assed immersed in the Kingdom of Names in the ongoing hapless lizard brain meta-narrative. When will this mindset ever change? Can we ever get to full frontal lobe “Cosmic insight” in matters of “organized religion” or will everyone’s IQ continue to just keep dropping like they have been trapped in the check out line at Wal-Mart just one hour too many?

xxx,

You are actually on solid ground about this.

I recommend this little book to every one seeking a higher level of insight:

“Prayers of the Cosmos: Meditations on the Aramaic Words of Jesus” by Neil Douglas-Klotz

http://tinyurl.com/yqwlfz

In Aramaic, Jesus’s word for “God The Father” would have been “Allah-Ha”.

The people of the Abrahamic religions have generally been total ignoramuses in the history and esoteric concepts of their own religion. It’s still appears to be the same old psychological journey from Jesus of Nazareth to Tomás de Torquemada.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom%C3%A1s_de_Torquemada

When will people start to see the same old and tired worn out psychological patterns in play in every religion century after century?

In fact, I believe the great gift to mankind of the Abrahamic religions actually IS that we have had 3,000 years now to study the psychopathology and utter dysfunctionality of “religious” organizations. And, of course, the Baha’i Faith as another religion in the long line of Abrahamic religions from the amazing cultures of the Middle East is keeping up DAILY CUTTING EDGE MINUTE BY MINUTE RESEARCH in this long and ancient tradition of lock step depth psychology run amok.

I think this long running experiment is actually quite useful as it continues even further down through the Ages in our time. Before we EVER have a planetary system of government in whatever form it eventually takes, if it is to ever be successful and ACTUALLY DO
SOMETHING USEFUL IN THE REAL WORLD to ACTUALLY BEGIN TO TRY TO SOLVE vital, pressing, problems facing ALL MANKIND, it will be absolutely necessary that every person on Earth have studied the psychological journey from Jesus of Nazareth to ten thousand Torquemadas
in every World Age for the safety and well being of the human race.

No real power will ever come to the Baha’i Faith as an organization until this counter balancing spiritual safety system is securely in place.

Otherwise the human race is destined for another round of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBzvamTC_Bo

So it seems by the current free fall situation in the Baha’i Faith, we are off to another traditional start on the long 3,000 year study:

“We have inherited a dangerous delusion from Christianity that our individual conscience is supreme. This is not a Baha’i belief. In the end, in the context of both our role in the community and our role in the greater world, we must be prepared to sacrifice our
personal convictions or opinions. The belief that individual conscience is supreme is equivalent to ‘taking partners with God’ which is abhorrent to the Teachings of the
Faith.”

- Douglas Martin Former Member of the Universal House of Justice Baha’i Faith

“Divorced from the institution of the Guardianship the World Order of Bahá’u'lláh would be mutilated and permanently deprived of that hereditary principle which, as ‘Abdu’l-Bahá has written, has been invariably upheld by the Law of God.

‘In all the Divine Dispensations,’ He states, in a Tablet addressed to a follower of the Faith in Persia, ‘the eldest son hath been given extraordinary distinctions. Even the station of prophethood hath been his birthright.’

Without such an institution the integrity of the Faith would be imperiled, and the stability of the entire fabric would be gravely endangered.

Its prestige would suffer, the means required to enable it to take a long, an uninterrupted view over a series of generations would be completely lacking, and the necessary guidance to define the sphere of the legislative action of its elected representatives would be totally withdrawn.”

- Shoghi Effendi First and Only Guardian of the Baha’i Faith The World Order of Baha’u'llah, p. 148

“Although deepening the friends’ understanding of the Covenant and increasing their love and loyalty to it are of paramount importance, the duties of the Auxiliary Board members for Protection do not end here.

The Board members must remain ever vigilant, MONITORING THE ACTIONS of those who, driven by the promptings of ego, seek to SOW THE SEEDS OF DOUBT in the minds of the friends and undermine the Faith.

(Editor’s Note: Personal Commentary On Organizational Thought Police Tendencies In Human Beings: ouch!)

In general, whenever believers become aware of such problems, they should immediately contact whatever institution they feel moved to turn to, whether it be a Counsellor, an Auxiliary Board member, the National Spiritual Assembly or their own Local Assembly.

It then becomes the duty of that institution to ensure that the report is fed into the correct channels and that all the other institutions affected are promptly informed. Not infrequently, the responsibility will fall on an Auxiliary Board member, in coordination with the Assembly concerned, to take some form of action in response to the situation.

This involvement will include counselling the believer in question; warning him, if necessary, of the consequences of his actions; and bringing to the attention of the Counsellors the gravity of the situation, which may call for their intervention.

Naturally, the Board member has to exert every effort to counteract the schemes and arrest the spread of the influence of those few who, despite attempts to guide them, eventually break the Covenant.”

- “The Institution of the Counsellors”
A DOCUMENT PREPARED BY THE UNIVERSAL HOUSE OF JUSTICE
BAHÁ’Í WORLD CENTRE
2001

I suggest Baha’is should, therefore, take vigilant note of the the Great Profound Lesson of the mind bending carnage and human wreckage of the 20th Century as they empower a professional lifetime incumbent class who have gamed the electoral processes of the Baha’i Faith to “Administrate” the Faith forever WHO ANSWER TO NO ONE ON EARTH:

“Liberty is not a means to a higher political end. It is itself the highest political end…liberty is the only object which benefits all alike, and provokes no sincere opposition…The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to to govern. EVERY CLASS IS UNFIT TO GOVERN…Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.”

- Lord Acton (1834-1902)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPU4p7UQOtU

I suggest THE COSMIC SPIRITUAL WARNING from Lord Baha’u'llah IS now upon us in 2008 as Baha’is in what we have allowed to happen within the Faith:

“They desired to ascend to a station that God ordained to be above their ranks, when the luminous comet expelled them from among the inhabitants of the kingdom of his presence.”

- Baha’u'llah Prophet-Founder of the Baha’i Faith
Tablet of the Holy Mariner

But I feel the incredible rise of the Internet will now change the equation on this sorry 3,000 year old experiment in unchecked and uncountered organizational depth psychology run amok in human history. There are some very rude awakenings coming very soon for some people and organizations on this planet on the photonic binary carrier wave that circles the ENTIRE EARTH NOW SEVEN TIMES EVERY SECOND. The people that can program the Intel x86 CPU instruction set in any high level or low level computer language are going to now wreck havoc on the mentality of group think cult bubbles EVERYWHERE on Earth. No one is safe from this Cosmic power now AT ALL.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikileaks

If this very tiny group of people currently leading the Baha’i Faith into catastrophe that ANSWER TO NO ONE are going to open files on the rank and file with impunity, the human race is going to retaliate by OPENING VERY PUBLIC FILES ON THEM WORLDWIDE on the Internet for the NEXT 1,000 YEARS.

These folks currently at the top of the Baha’i Faith just don’t seem to be up to speed yet on comprehending the astonishing implications of planetary MOSFET broadband switching Eithernet technology even after almost 30 years of stunning development from the days at
Xerox SPARC.

As this all unfolds with Internet 2 the stakes will go up.

You get elected dog catcher anywhere on Earth in the Baha’i Faith and you as an individual human being will now go into the greatest “REVERSE PUBLIC PANOPTICON” in human history. You will have EVERY PERSON ON EARTH commenting on whatever comes out of your mouth, your
personal actions, the personal actions of your entire family, and your job performance 24/7/365/1000. Someone sooner or later will start a planetary RateTheAO.com and there will be reports on EVERY UHJ member, EVERY NSA member, EVERY Counsellor, EVERY ABM, EVERY AABM, and EVERY LSA member ON EARTH 24/7/365/1000. What they say, what they do, everyone’s review of their job performance, competence, and a full personal account of EVERY encounter with any person representing the Administrative Order worldwide. ANYWHERE.

And there is absolutely NOTHING they can do about it even with a good lawyer EXCEPT pray that people are fair and just as they, themselves, in their elected positions SHOULD BE be in EVERY action THEMSELVES. This is now their ONLY WORLDWIDE spiritual protection: justice and fairness in their OWN actions in word and deed. And justice now INCLUDES competence in job performance in the PLANETARY BIG PEOPLE world now. Because the reach of the Internet is planetary and it’s record will go down through ALL the Ages to come. So everyone in the AO had better engage this breathtaking inner vista in their mind’s eye BEFORE they open their mouths to speak and give their opinions on ANYTHING or write any “guiding documents” for Counsellors or anybody else or give any “elucidations” for the edification of the souls of the rank and file on their word processors at the World Center in their marble offices I helped pay for.

So the sorry, sorry psychological experiment of the Abrahamic religions in world history up until now is NOW going to take a new and very, very, very interesting turn!

We’ll study the psychological and organizational journey from Jesus of Nazareth to Tomás de Torquemada now in breathtaking worldwide step by step detail!

You Go Abrahamic religions and do your traditional organizational brain chemistry thing now with THE CAMERAS ROLLING WORLDWIDE 24/7/365/1000 and let’s see how it all plays out this time out!

That Maid of Heaven (the Mysterious Spirit of the New World Age) is One Tough Lady in what She has now brought to All Mankind.

Put on some popcorn and watch the show for the next 1,000 years.

The Promised Day HAS Come.

Everyone keep posting!

Best regards to everyone,

Craig

“Thanks for all you’re doing, and I GREATLY look forward to your blog.”

Oh no … je suis un agent provocateur … thank you for all YOU are doing!

The blog will not be entirely my responsibility … it will involve the efforts of two or three others as well … with (eventually) an acknowledgment of a non-Deist approach to the concept of divinity (i.e. the theological construct called “Manifestation of God”). It will encourage a kind of “willing suspension of disbelief” in order to appreciate the mythopoetic content of the Babi faith. Literalists and dogmatists of whatever persuasion may continue to avert their eyes.

As for the responses of the mental sheep slaves of the Baaaha’i belief system … mmm … time for some ghormeh sabzi!